THE BLITZ MOVE

What do you want to see in an advanced A&A game?
Share your thoughts... Contribute to the ultimate A&A game design.

Can you dig this Blitz move ???

Yes, I just love it.
7
70%
no, I am afraid to anything new
3
30%
I must wait and see what my friends thinks about this.
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 10

User avatar
Sabre Von Manteuffel
Posts: 112
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:22 pm
Location: Rusafa-(East) Baghdad, Iraq

Post by Sabre Von Manteuffel » Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:30 pm

IL,

I completely agree with your "pay to play" concept...and I'm not saying that their should be NO exploitation....

only that I would rather see this new map first, and that it could be done in a different manner.

I will check my game in my office tomorrow for a "Mech INF" concept (not just unit) that we use to play with about 10 years ago.

I will edit this post once I get to my office (but that's about 11 hours from now).

Check back then.

-Sabre
If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you are reading it in English, thank an American Veteran!

User avatar
adlertag
Posts: 1445
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:28 pm
Location: norway

Post by adlertag » Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:03 pm

Yeah, you sure run to your office, man.
And come back soon, you hear me !!
And when you are at your office, please fix your avatar at the same time.

User avatar
Imperious leader
Posts: 5207
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:04 am
Location: Moving up to phase line red...

Post by Imperious leader » Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:43 pm

OK i await your good ideas....
We really need an Axis and Allies World War one game so i can play that on August 1st, 2014.

User avatar
Sabre Von Manteuffel
Posts: 112
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:22 pm
Location: Rusafa-(East) Baghdad, Iraq

my "good ideas" for the critics.

Post by Sabre Von Manteuffel » Wed Sep 14, 2005 9:57 am

IL & the Eagle,

I did not mean to sound condescending with the “check back” comment, just that most of my A&A stuff is at work, where I occasionally get the chance to play with the other Soldiers after work.

Anyway, here are a few units/concepts that I have hand-jammed from my ‘regular’ groups in ’94, ’97, and ’98….

I have modified them as appropriate for this post and the Revised edition, but here goes:

ARTILLERY: We used additional AA guns painted to represent Arty, interestingly enough, with an A/D capability of “2”. BUT, they cost 8. The reason for it was this: as Larry has enforced, “a plane is a plane is a plane” we too had the “arty is arty” as far as a piece goes, but allowed it to be used in 2 ways. “Short Range” i.e. with the units on ATK/DEF with normal 2/2, or “Long Range” where they would get a “4” on ATK and “3” on DEF with a ONE ROLL per Arty Opening Fire shot that eliminates enemy units before the follow-on Combat ensues—these Long Range would be arty pieces in adjacent territories (for ATTACKER ONLY). ie. Germany attacks Cauc from Ukraine, takes 2 Arty in as “short range” and leaves 1 behing in Ukr for “long range” and uses a shot from a Western Russia-based ARTY for a “long range” prep. IL: This prep could even be used as a initial B&E push, but keep reading…

--I still like this ARTY concept, but think it needs some tweaking.

MECH INF: (As I was becoming a Cavalry Scout, we actually referred to this as “Armored Cav” at the time and painted extra Armor units with the Red/White Cav Guidon on the turrets…but MECH INF is more accurate):

The cost was an “8”, but the ATK/DEF depended on how it was used:

If defending “in-country” (or the territory attacked) they would represent the “screen line” and for the first combat round would roll at a “3” and bump the Armor up to a “3” (from the classic version) or +1, to represent the “screen line” fixing the enemy for the Armor to punch. If used on the initial Attack they roll at a “3.”

The difference here (which would be negated by a “one round of combat” method) is that these units could also be used to reinforce ATTK and DEF. For example, Germany attacks Cauc from Ukraine, and first round of combat gets ugly for Germany…any MECH INF from within one territory (notice that drops movement to “1” vs. “2”) can be brought in to reinforce the effort, but would ATTK at “2” vs. “3”. The same for the Defense: in the same case, USSR may have some MECH INF he purchased sitting in Moscow, in this case, AFTER the first round of combat in the Caucs, he could bring in his MECH INF at a “2”.

As written this may sound very confusing, but when played it was always easy enough, and made you think twice about a 50/50 or 60/40 ATTK when your enemy has some MECH INF (i.e. RESERVE) sitting in the back field.

--Also, on this note, IL, I think this is when the B&E would come in. I think it could be incorporated that once you’ve defeated the enemy you could utilize MECH INF/ARM that was NOT used in the initial push to do a “first round” only softening up of the adjacent enemy territory. This helps eliminate the “all eggs in one basket” where people leave MOSCOW (for example) completely unmanned, and allows you to conduct the initial skirmish that takes place as one country is “retreating” and using its rearguard to establish a new FLOT (uh, forward line of own troops). If both sides area allowed to retreat, this could even be the penalty for it---the ground troops from one side engage only the ground troops from the other’s adjacent territory for one round.

It needs some help as assimilated into Advanced, but I think it has some potential to allow MECH INF to do more than just be a new piece, and can align with your B&E concept—just on a reduced scale.

We also had a concept for Paratroopers back in ’94, and revised in ’97, but the final concept we played and felt was best is this:

PARATROOPERS carried on Bombers, but Bomber flight reduced to 4 (or 6 if LRAC developed)—but, no more than 1 of those one the flight path can be a Sea Zone (this prevents using the planes as substitutes for trannies). 2 Paratroopers per plane…if AA gun strikes, all units dead. Paratroopers A/D on a “2”, but if “dropped” then their ATTK is Opening Fire for the duration.

--Again, here, IL, I could concede some B&E considering the Paratroopers would be used for the secondary assault to secure bridges and then the ground forces could roll in for one round of combat. Perhaps as an AA Gun roll- a “2” or less secures the bridgehead or something.

FIGHTERS and AIR SUPERIORITY:

This was also game-tested numerous times and all the regulars at 3 different duty locations liked it: When an area is attacked, and there is NO AA Gun, then for every FTR + that one of the combatants has bumps to a +1. For example, Japan attacks India and brings in 4 FTRs against UK’s 2. Then the 2 UK FTR will deflect 2 of the JAP FTR but the 2 other JAP FTR will bump to +1 to resemble the unhindered strafing of LOCs, front-line troops, etc.

This +/- factor would change as combat resumed, for instance UK loses one of its FTR, then a 3rd JAP FTR would bump up to +1. (Of course +1 will be different with a D12 game, but you get the point). [Which by the way is going to kill me :evil: since I own about 100 D6 in multiple colors so I throw all units dice at the same time].

RETREAT: --Because we also played that it MUST be an INF unit to take/hold land, that players MUST retreat or take off their other pieces before removing their last INF (Defenders could also retreat, but had to forfeit 50% of each “like unit” (ie 4 Defending INF would throw only 2 dice---3 INF and 1 ARTY would still throw 2 dice.)
RANGER BATS/SPEC OPS: --this was a concept that developed because no one liked the “Never Die AA Gun,” but at the same time did not want to pay more than 5 IPC to change some of its characteristics… This unit-type was only played on the Classic AA back in 97-99, never game-tested on Revised. So, Ranger Bats (Infantry w/ Black –oh, wait that is TAN now- Berets and bases) cost 8 IPC, but had some very unique capabilities:

Attack at 1. But fires opening fire AND chooses the ground unit (incl. Grounded Bombers) that it kills.
Defend at a 3.

Can also “Raid” in lieu of an Attack. Raids work as an “opening fire” where they are sent in ahead of attack to take out the AA Gun. If they raid, they can not also attack. Defender rolls for a “1” to compromise the mission. Any Rangers still alive after the compromise roll will roll for at a “2” to destroy the AA Gun. (Destroy later translated to Damaged that automatically repaired AFTER non-cbt movement phase). Rangers were also Airborne Qualified.


Here are some other concepts that were old ones I rehashed with a buddy of mine that we incorporated into Revised…(note: we also had a slightly modified map that I made):

Infantry on Amphibious Defense: All defending INF units will defend at a “3” when defending against an Amphibious Assault. All defending Arty will also defend at a “3” in this scenario.

Exceptions: If Attacking unit is deploying from one Amphibious landing and one from an adjacent land territory, then the amount of defending INF and ARTY will reduce to 50% at “3” and 50% at “2”—always rounding UP.

Regardless of the INF or Arty increase, the Air Superiority Rule is in effect during AmpAsslts.

Battleship and Destroyer (bombardments were rolls of “2” for Destroyer) bombardments are still ONE-Shot Opening Fire rolls.

Destroyers: Destroyers can conduct shore bombardment at a roll of “2” during opening fire of Amphibious Assaults.

Battleships: 2 Hit Battleships receive and maintain damage: If hit, then BS will remain turned to the side and from the moment of accessed hit, it will Attk/Def at a “3” (including the Japanese BS), and shore bombardments will degrade to a “2.” The BS will REMAIN damaged until the players next turn and during the Purchase Units phase will announce intention to repair the BS. A die is roll and the number on the die is the amount of IPCs forfeited to Repair the BS. From that point, the BS returns to full capabilities. NOTE: IOT repair a BS, the vessel MUST be in a SZ adjacent to a land territory owned by you during the Purchase Unit Phase—this does not include islands or Ally controlled territory.

Island Air Defense:
The owner (not Allies—owner only) of island territories does NOT need to include entering the Sea Zone as a move during a COMBAT MOVE (simulating already in air over water for mission). However, NON COMBAT Moves must count the TAKE OFF from Islands as a move, but NOT the landing.

And here is a small tweak of the Order of Play that we utilized:

Order of Play Change:

• The Game will begin with USSR conducting a NON-COMBAT movement ONLY. They will not purchase units, conduct Combat Phase, or Collect Income.

This is to simulate the end of the Red Army 1941-42 Winter Counter-Offensive grinding to a halt and their preparation for the coming German spring Offensive.

• The Order of Play for the remainder of the game will then continue as follows:
1. Germany 4. UK
2. USSR 5. USA
3. Japan

• America will begin the game with 1/2 Income and will collect 31 IPCs after its first round, REGARDLESS of its production. All Rounds thereafter, Income is collected as usual.

This is to simulate the American Economy “becoming” the War Machine, not an overnight transformation.

We also incorporate(d) some NAs that have been worked on/off since ’94.

USSR: Was pretty much word for word your (IL) concept on them standing alone and using either Archangel or Cauc for Lend/Lease.

Germany: Combined arms “blitzkrieg” I’ve already covered here.

Japan: Battleships “5”s instead of “4” but when damaged still dropped to “3” until repaired. Infantry Def 3 on islands---if not using the generic Island Defense as above.

UK’s AA guns bumped to “2”.
USA: had Marines as special unit: IPC 4: Attk 1 (2 on Amphib Asslt); Def 2; Def 3 on islands---if not using the generic Island Defense as above.

So, gentlemen, there are my “good ideas.” I think all of them have possibilities for inclusion into Revised+ or the AAA. Some have been discussed here before in different aspects by many people, and others may be “fresh” (to this forum anyway—my yellowed notebook paper says otherwise!).


--Oh, too stupid to make the avatar thing work, so I just took it off. Work on that some other day. With all the stuff at work today this retyping of hand-jammed 90s stuff killed me!!

so, now to the floor for comments, criticisms, or drive-bys.... :twisted:
If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you are reading it in English, thank an American Veteran!

User avatar
Imperious leader
Posts: 5207
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:04 am
Location: Moving up to phase line red...

Post by Imperious leader » Wed Sep 14, 2005 3:31 pm

It will take time to sort this last post. But i will try to understand it fully before comments.
We really need an Axis and Allies World War one game so i can play that on August 1st, 2014.

User avatar
Sabre Von Manteuffel
Posts: 112
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:22 pm
Location: Rusafa-(East) Baghdad, Iraq

Post by Sabre Von Manteuffel » Thu Sep 15, 2005 3:33 am

IL,

I was thinking more about your B&E a bit more as well, after sorting through all the old House Rules I put here yesterday...and actually now agree with the concept....albeit to a smaller scale.

What if you take your B&E along with the Long Range Arty and MECH INF concept (obviously with some tweaking on all three concepts), and then when you conquer a territory and want to exploit your initial success, it still allows for the Defender to send in his Reserves to plug the gap ala MECH INF from adjacent territories....

Now I think there is potential for the B&E concept, oder?

-Sabre
If you can read this, thank a teacher.
If you are reading it in English, thank an American Veteran!

User avatar
Imperious leader
Posts: 5207
Joined: Tue Jul 06, 2004 3:04 am
Location: Moving up to phase line red...

Post by Imperious leader » Thu Sep 15, 2005 2:44 pm

Yea sure it can be made to work. I think only the active player should get any movement rather than allow the defender to counter with his own mechanized ground units. OK come up with something to best simulate this combining the different approaches.

Breakthrough and Exploitation

Modifiers for some air units (close ground support missions) : 1/1 basis with each matching armor unit goes +1 on attacks with matching plane unit.

Artillery modifiers for infantry 1/1 basis (this should be for defense rather than attack)

Armor modifier for infantry +1 matching 1/1 basis

SS unit modifier unit +1 for 2 infantry with attacking SS panzer tank

But this is basic regurgitation of my own rules for some of my games.
We really need an Axis and Allies World War one game so i can play that on August 1st, 2014.

User avatar
adlertag
Posts: 1445
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:28 pm
Location: norway

Post by adlertag » Sat Sep 17, 2005 11:33 am

Combined Arms system
The Attacker

*Each att. Bomber roll a dice, 4 or less is hit.

Each successful Bomber-roll boost up one matching Tank.
*Every boosted-up Tanks roll a dice, 4 or less is hit.
*The remaining Tanks roll dice, 3 or less is hit.

Each successful Tank-roll boost up one matching Infantry.
*Every boosted-up Infantry roll a dice, 2 or less is hit.
*The remaining Infantry roll dice, 1 is hit.

Assault system
The Attacker

*Each att. artillery roll a dice, 2 or less is hit.

Each successful Artillery roll boost up one matching infantry.
*Every boosted up Infantry roll a dice, 2 or less is hit.
*The remaining Infantry roll dice, 1 is hit

I love this system, how about you, Larry ??

One idea behind this is that expensive units will become more importent, since they boost up cheaper units, and infantry-stack standing alone will not be that vital anymore.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests